MoFo Perspectives: The Cyberstalking Resource Initiative

In this episode of MoFo Perspectives, Morrison Foerster partner and co-chair of the firm’s Global Privacy & Data Security practice Alex van der Wolk speaks with associate Whitney Lee about her pro bono work with CYREIN, The Cyberstalking Resource Initiative. Whitney founded CYREIN in 2018 to support victims of cyberstalking and cyber harassment after graduating from law school.

Transcript

Intro: Welcome to MoFo Perspectives, a podcast by Morrison Foerster where we share the perspectives of our clients, colleagues, subject matter experts, and lawyers.

Alex: Hello, and welcome to MoFo Perspectives. I’m your host, Alex van der Wolk, and I’m the co-chair of Morrison Foerster’s Global Privacy and Data Security group. And in this special episode of MoFo Perspectives, in honor of Cybersecurity Month and National Pro Bono Week 2022, we will discuss CYREIN, a pro bono consulting firm whose mission is to support victims of cyberstalking and cyber harassment. Today, I’m speaking with the founder of CYREIN, who happens to also be an associate in our firm’s Privacy and Data Security group and National Security group, Whitney Lee. Whitney’s practice focuses on advising clients on cybersecurity incidents and other sensitive matters relating to national security and crisis management. She has been featured in Bloomberg Law’s “They’ve Got Next” series as a rising star in the area of privacy and data security and was recently named to the National Black Lawyer’s Top 40 Under 40 list. Very impressive. And welcome, Whitney.

Whitney: Thank you for having me. It’s great to be here.

Alex: So, let’s start by talking about the name of your organization, which is pronounced “siren,” but it’s not actually written “siren.” So maybe you can tell us what it stands for and a little bit more about the organization?

Whitney: So CYREIN is an abbreviation of our organization’s full name, which is the Cyberstalking Resource Initiative. So, we founded our organization in 2018 to provide resources to victims of cyberstalking and cyber harassment. After learning of the impact that cyberstalking can have, we wanted to be in a position to help and offer support to victims who are often unsure of where to turn for assistance in situations like that.

Alex: That’s really interesting. So, tell us about your background, and what motivated you to start CYREIN.

Whitney: So, as you mentioned, I’m an associate in MoFo’s Global Privacy and Data Security group, as well as MoFo’s National Security group and the Crisis Management group. With regard to the Privacy group, ours is a multidisciplinary practice, and we advise on a broad range of privacy and data protection matters, including global privacy law compliance and incident response. My practice in particular focuses mainly on crisis management and incident response, which involves supporting clients through the entire life cycle of a cyber incident, which can include conducting investigations, advising on any legal or regulatory obligations related to an incident, and assisting clients with communications to the public. I’ve always had an interest in crisis management, and so my work at CYREIN and my work at MoFo both touch on this. As for what motivated me to start CYREIN, I founded the organization just after law school. So, for context, in addition to having a JD, I’d also just finished getting an LLM in international criminal law with a focus on cybercrime. So, at the time, I was really thinking about these issues, and one of my college friends was actually being cyberstalked. So, as I supported my friend through that experience, I realized that there weren’t a lot of places that people could go to get help in situations like that. At the time, most victims of cyberstalking would receive like two main pieces of advice in that situation. And those were like “just call the police” and “delete your online presence.” So delete your social media accounts, delete your websites, what have you. And in many cases, I found that this advice was just unhelpful, because many victims of cyberstalking are women or members of marginalized groups that don’t always feel comfortable going to the police, or, in some cases, they’re not confident they will be well supported if they go to the police. There are also—and this comes up a lot with our clients—there are also people who can’t just delete their online presence, like their websites or their social media accounts. Because a lot of people rely on their online presence for their livelihood. For example, small business owners who use social media, like, for example, Instagram or TikTok, to market their businesses. Or content creators, whose whole job is being online. So the advice “just delete your online presence” is really unhelpful for people in that situation. So, we founded this organization so that we could be in a position to help people who don’t know where to turn in that situation.

Alex: That makes a lot of sense. And you know what’s interesting—I mean, my first inclination wouldn’t be, or have been, to say you’re the victim of stalking, which—you know, offline stalking or cyberstalking, how much of a difference is there? So, my first inclination would also have been, “Can you just go to the police?” Maybe you can talk a little bit about the support services that CYREIN provides to cyberstalking and cyber harassment victims and maybe even how that relates to what the police would do in a similar situation.

Whitney: Sure. So, the services that we provide fall into two main categories: private counseling and group sessions. For our private counseling clients, we advise on a lot of different topics, such as social media management, so that’s helping clients manage their online presence; personal and home device safety, and this is something that law enforcement has a lot of experience in; and depending on the situation, we can also act as liaisons between our clients and other social support services. So, for example, domestic violence counselors or law enforcement, depending on our client’s comfort level with those services. And for group sessions, we offer a different form of social media training and training on how to keep children safe online. And that form of training has gotten very popular with parents in the last year and a half. And we also offer training to content creators on how to protect themselves as they create and share content online, particularly if they’re going to be sharing a lot of content about where they go in a day, so a day in their life, or a lot of content that’s filmed in their home. These are circumstances that do require a lot of like very specialized advice, because people want to be safe when they’re sharing these different aspects of their life online.

Alex: So, in essence, CYREIN not only lowers the bar for people to step forward and solicit for support, but it sounds like CYREIN also provides a lot of additional support that, for example, the police or law enforcement would not be able to do.

Whitney: Absolutely. And then, in addition to all that, we also offer training sessions with certain community organizations and law enforcement partners to raise awareness about cyberstalking. That’s like what it is, why it’s harmful, how it can escalate into physical stalking and physical violence. And in these sessions, we also teach groups about the way that cyberstalking can be used as a tool of control in domestic violence situations and the risks associated with connected devices. So, for example, something that we’re seeing a lot lately, we’re seeing situations where our clients’ current or former romantic partners will install spyware on their devices to monitor them. So that’s monitoring, for example, their movements, or their spending, or their communications. So, in our group sessions, we educate people about these issues. And all of our services, that’s our individual services and our group services, are provided at no cost, so that cost isn’t a barrier to receiving assistance or to learn about these topics.

Alex: That’s fantastic. I think it’s a great, great initiative that CYREIN is doing and that you’re doing in relation to that. And indeed, I like that you underscore the aspect that this is a pro bono consulting firm, because I think that’s incredibly important as well. Maybe you want to reflect a little bit more on why this type of pro bono work is important?

Whitney: As with all pro bono work, I think it’s important to give back to underserved communities and to lend our time and our expertise to people who might not otherwise be able to access these services. Pro bono work is very important to me. I’m very active in our firm’s pro bono work, and it’s just really great to be at a firm like MoFo, which believes in the value of pro bono and invests a great amount of time each year in pro bono services.

Alex: So, making the connection to the work that you do for our firm, at Mofo, and the work that CYREIN does, kind of building on top of that, do you find that your work with CYREIN intersects or otherwise has touchpoints with the work that you do with MoFo? Maybe you can talk a little bit about that?

Whitney: Oh, absolutely. So, in both positions, I’m working to manage cyber risks and support clients through crises. Although the type of crisis is different, a lot of the skills are the same, so problem solving, understanding the facts of the situation, and being the calm person in the room when your client is going through something terrible. In this way, I think being at MoFo and being in the Privacy group, as well as the National Security group and the Crisis Management group, really helps me do the work that I do at CYREIN and vice versa. So, I’m really grateful to be at a firm, and in practice groups, that allows me the freedom to do both.

Alex: That’s fantastic. And having worked with you for a little bit, I can definitely recognize that calm person in the room that you referred to.

Whitney: Thank you.

Alex: So, what is the greatest piece of advice that you would give to individuals concerned about their online presence or safety?

Whitney: I would say that there’s no one-size-fits-all approach to online safety. But one piece of advice I would give is that, before you post something online—so, for example, a picture or a video—give some thought to the ways that someone with bad intentions might be able to use the content that you’re sharing. So, for example, like to you, a video tour of your new apartment or new home might seem very innocuous. But to someone with bad intentions, they’re thinking, “Great, now I’ve seen the floorplan or layout of the inside of your house.” Another example, this comes up a lot, is that parents post first day of school pictures with their children outside of their schools, and not realizing that they’ve now revealed the name and location of their child’s school and, in some cases, the name of the teacher or the classroom that their child is in. So, it’s really important before you post to be mindful of what you’re sharing online.

Alex: I think that’s a great piece of advice, and it goes very much towards the issue of awareness. And a lot of people will look at the benefits of social media and having an online presence, and one of the things that I absolutely agree with is to be aware of what the impact can be of those kinds of posts. For any one of our listeners to be interested about things you can do to increase your online safety and security generally, visit our posts on LinkedIn and Twitter for the Cybersecurity Month, and definitely you will find more resources and more information that you can find about these kinds of things. But absolutely agree with that piece of advice, Whitney, thanks so much. So maybe, just to come to a closure on this session, is there any place where people can find more information about CYREIN? Where would people go to find out more and solicit, potentially, the services of CYREIN?

Whitney: Sure. For more information about us and the work that we do, please visit our website, which is cyrein.com. So that’s C-Y-R-E-I-N.com.

Alex: That makes a lot of sense. Thank you, Whitney. I think it’s great that you started CYREIN. I am absolutely thrilled to have heard more about it and a little bit of the background as to how you got here and what it entails. Thank you so much for coming on today’s show and hope to get you back soon again.

Whitney: Thank you, Alex. I appreciate it.

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